Secondary charge

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bellebsc
Posts: 149
Joined: Mon Jul 09, 2018 10:57 am

Secondary charge

Post by bellebsc »

Hi John

Charge phase
So as we know a unit may wheel FIRST before charging and then make its charge in a straight line perpendicular to its front.

So a British cav charged an infantry unit in line. The line failed a DT and retreated, the cav have 14cm left and just to the right of the cavs front is another target. ( outside of its frontage )

Now is this still the case if the original target who retreated due to a failed DT that the chargers MUST continue in a STRAIGHT line with their leftover movement or can they wheel again to contact a new target?

Also same question as such but is a secondary charge classed as a charge on albeit it's the same charge .

Thanks

Ricky

Archdukek
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Joined: Tue Sep 03, 2013 11:49 pm
Location: Linlithgow, West Lothian, UK

Re: Secondary charge

Post by Archdukek »

Hi Ricky,
In the circumstances you describe I would expect the cavalry to attempt to contact the retreating infantry if it can. However, the rules at the top of page 45 says the chargers can either Take the Ground or Charge against other targets within reach. In the latter case I would treat it like a Charge On! result which allows them to engage a new target within 45’ of their front. Seems the simplest solution.

John

bellebsc
Posts: 149
Joined: Mon Jul 09, 2018 10:57 am

Re: Secondary charge

Post by bellebsc »

Hi John.

The infantry retreated as they rolled low on the dice for their DT and as a result the cavalry did not have enough movement to catch them..


I initially agreed with what you said but then I had problems when analysing the situation.
Perhaps the danger is that allowing this is as identical to a VICTORY which is after both units role and one loses due to a rout, where as this was just an initial charge that as the rules say you must charge straight on and contact other units within reach .

Just to add On page 50 if a unit evades then continue the charge and declare new target and follow the charge procedure . However the wheeling bonus has by then already been used.

Edit* the evade procedure would be the same as if a unit retreats before the charge home perhaps?

Ricky.
Last edited by bellebsc on Mon Mar 16, 2020 9:39 am, edited 1 time in total.

bellebsc
Posts: 149
Joined: Mon Jul 09, 2018 10:57 am

Re: Secondary charge

Post by bellebsc »

???

Archdukek
Posts: 5043
Joined: Tue Sep 03, 2013 11:49 pm
Location: Linlithgow, West Lothian, UK

Re: Secondary charge

Post by Archdukek »

Hi Ricky,
The FAQ confirms that when charging a unit which evades the chargers can continue the charge straight ahead against any new target within reach. You could certainly follow that approach in your original example which narrows the options available to the cavalry.

Personally as I said I would be inclined to be more generous in the circumstances you described and treat it as the equivalent of a rout. Although the DT is determined at the 5cm [3”] point in your example I would imagine the infantry unit dissolving as the cavalry advance towards them so giving the cavalry time to change direction to a modest degree.

Your call. If you need a definitive answer you will need to wait for DB to pronounce.

John

bellebsc
Posts: 149
Joined: Mon Jul 09, 2018 10:57 am

Re: Secondary charge

Post by bellebsc »

Hi John.

Yeah I read the FAQ on that and Mr Brown has written it for evading and dispersing but nothing about retreating units. He does confirm my feeling that you still charge in a straight line which I feel is the right thing to do as its just a continuation of the charge movement which allows the two options either take take ground or charge STRAIGHT ahead. I did originally think of giving them the scope to maneuver but again after reflection it didn't sit right as again it felt like a second charge after a victory.

I really appreciate your time on this one John and 99.9% you are my go to person for clarification but as I'm stuck doing anymore movement on the game til I get some friendly help from as you said Mr Brown.


Thanks again

Ricky

DCRBrown
Posts: 502
Joined: Mon Oct 31, 2016 5:04 pm

Re: Secondary charge

Post by DCRBrown »

R,

Please refer to the FAQs and add Charge Target Retreats out of Charge Range.

So, if a Charge Target Evades, Retreats out of range or Disperses - Chargers Options.Chargers may choose to either: a) Take the Ground, b) charge on and catch the evaders/retreaters if the chargers have sufficient charge move to reach or c) continue the charge straight ahead against any new target within reach using the remaining charge movement. Simply repeat the charge procedure against the new target.(p50)

Hope that helps.

DB

bellebsc
Posts: 149
Joined: Mon Jul 09, 2018 10:57 am

Re: Secondary charge

Post by bellebsc »

Hi DB

So straight ahead it is.

Thank you

Ricky

bellebsc
Posts: 149
Joined: Mon Jul 09, 2018 10:57 am

Re: Secondary charge

Post by bellebsc »

Hi DB

I went back into the FAQ and there is nothing for retreating units so perhaps an amendment placed as this would have saved me asking the question and annoying you 😂

Ricky

Archdukek
Posts: 5043
Joined: Tue Sep 03, 2013 11:49 pm
Location: Linlithgow, West Lothian, UK

Re: Secondary charge

Post by Archdukek »

bellebsc wrote:
Sun Mar 22, 2020 11:51 am
Hi DB

I went back into the FAQ and there is nothing for retreating units so perhaps an amendment placed as this would have saved me asking the question and annoying you 😂

Ricky
Hi Ricky,
I think that was what Dave was suggesting. Namely you should amend your copy of the FAQ to add “Charge Target Retreats out of Charge Range” to the paragraph you found earlier. ;)

But then we would have missed out on our discussion of the options. :D
John

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