Anti-tank value of hmgs/mmgs

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topi
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Anti-tank value of hmgs/mmgs

Post by topi » Sun Sep 22, 2013 4:50 pm

Hi,

Just browsing through the CoC early war lists and noticed that for example British tanks mounting only hmg had AP of 1 (and normal tripod mounted vickers apparently 0?) whereas Boys has AP 3. Looking at the IABSM values (In the footsteps of legions) hmg/mmg is equal to Boys at close range and superior at longer ranges. Where does the difference come from? New research, games modeling something differently, AP mechanics changed between IABSM editions or yours truly just missing something? I'd like to use both rules for same campaign set in 1940 and difference actually means that you suddenly want to prefer different weapons for the same task when system changes - mostly light tanks and ACs involved, so light AT weapons do have a role.

TIA,
Topi

EvilGinger
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Re: Anti-tank value of hmgs/mmgs

Post by EvilGinger » Sun Sep 22, 2013 5:01 pm

The boyes Anti tank rifle is an odd weapon in France it was afflicted with a significant proportion of the available ammunition being actually practice ammunition not the intended armour piercing round by the 1941 campaigning in north Africa this problem had been corrected hence the higher AP value.

As for the AP rating of HMG's these are generally .50 or equivalent and have an armour piercing value of 2. Some MMG's & similar weapons mounted on vehicles which are rifle calibre where issued with armour piercing ammunition and get an AP value of 1 as a result.

the weapon on the Vicars Mark VIc is a 15mm weapon firing no Ap rounds as far as I can tell. I refer you to the following thread.

viewtopic.php?f=35&t=298

:evil: Ginger
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topi
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Location: Helsinki, Finland
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Re: Anti-tank value of hmgs/mmgs

Post by topi » Sun Sep 22, 2013 5:43 pm

Hi,

Yes, that much I more or less knew (apart from practice ammo, that must have been a merry discovery..), but if you look at the IABSM values, mmg is superior also during '41. And it is quite consistent through the "In the footsteps of legions" supplement, so I started wondering if something had changed in the mechanics. (Before looking at CoC I just assumed that rifle calibre ap rounds were a bit more efficient than I thought and having high rate of fire adds some extra excitement at the receiving end, too.)

EvilGinger
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Re: Anti-tank value of hmgs/mmgs

Post by EvilGinger » Sun Sep 22, 2013 6:09 pm

The practice ammo was why the Germans who captures loads of it & boyes rifles thought they where too rubbish to adopt when they evaluated them as for the rest I have looked at the in the foot steps of the legions and note the differences. However beyond commenting that its an IABSM2 supplement & such stuff was altered in the change to IABSM3, compare Vpered Na Berlin to its IABSM2 equivalents, I don't have the specialist knowledge Richard has on this.

:evil: Ginger
Dark lord at large....

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