Proposal for Chinese Nationalist Army List

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m1017242
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Joined: Fri Nov 20, 2020 8:22 am

Proposal for Chinese Nationalist Army List

Post by m1017242 »

Hi guys, probablysomeone brought this up before, but I wish to ask for some idea on making a Chinese Nationalist army list for my friend.

What I have on hand:
  • - An organisation chart of the German-trained Divisions from wikipedia, confirms with Chinese sources but cannot eliminate chance of self-referencing, that suggests:
    An officer with C96 pistol
    3 squads of 13 each with 1 NCO with SMG(usually MP18), 1 ZB26 with crew of 2 and 10 rifles
    I highly suspect it further divide into MG team of 4 and rifle team of 8 much like the German 1939 platoon as this organisation was suggest by German military advisor in 1934.
  • - A short list of support equipment that they have:
    • - MG08 machine gun
    • - Year 20 Type 82mm Mortar, a modified copy of the Brandt Mle 27/31, only 2 per company so whether it can provide barrage support is doubtful
    • - Various types of 20mm cannons, Madson, Solothurn, Oerlikon and Breda are all used with no mention on the carriage
    • - PaK 35 37mm AT gun
    • - Krupp M1903 75mm infantry gun
    • - Panzer I
    • - Sd.Kfz. 221/222/223 (maybe ignore the 223?)
What I lack are ideas for national characteristics, oh glorious forum please share me your infinite wisdom.

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Truscott Trotter
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Re: Proposal for Chinese Nationalist Army List

Post by Truscott Trotter »

A really good source of info ona complex topic , got a kindle copy for $6:
The basic unit was the section, which consisted of a sergeant section leader, two senior privates or corporals as assistant section leaders, and 13 privates. The standard personal weapon was to have been the 7.9mm Hanyang rifle, but a wide variety of rifle types was actually in use. Two of the men in each section were unarmed, serving as ammunition bearers, with one doubling as a cook. Three such sections, plus a lieutenant platoon leader and an orderly, made up the rifle platoon. The company headquarters consisted of the company commander (a captain), a special service officer, an administrative sergeant, a supply sergeant, two buglers, an orderly, and a cook."
(from "Kangzhan: Guide to Chinese Ground Forces 1937–45" by Leland Ness, Bin Shih)

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Capt Fortier
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Re: Proposal for Chinese Nationalist Army List

Post by Capt Fortier »

Re: the National Revolutionary Army (NRA) national characteristics, I think it could include "Dare to Die". This could be a senior leader can use 2 CI to order a team to become "diehards", or an alternative might be any leader can use 1 CI to create a one-man tank hunter team that attacks using grenades and petrol with A.P. strike of 6 doubling any Shock inflicted, but is automatically killed himself.
Capt Fortier

“Frapper l'ennemi, c'est bien. Frapper l'imagination, c'est mieux.” - Jean de Lattre de Tassigny

m1017242
Posts: 15
Joined: Fri Nov 20, 2020 8:22 am

Re: Proposal for Chinese Nationalist Army List

Post by m1017242 »

Truscott Trotter wrote:
Sat May 15, 2021 10:59 pm
A really good source of info ona complex topic , got a kindle copy for $6:
The basic unit was the section, which consisted of a sergeant section leader, two senior privates or corporals as assistant section leaders, and 13 privates. The standard personal weapon was to have been the 7.9mm Hanyang rifle, but a wide variety of rifle types was actually in use. Two of the men in each section were unarmed, serving as ammunition bearers, with one doubling as a cook. Three such sections, plus a lieutenant platoon leader and an orderly, made up the rifle platoon. The company headquarters consisted of the company commander (a captain), a special service officer, an administrative sergeant, a supply sergeant, two buglers, an orderly, and a cook."
(from "Kangzhan: Guide to Chinese Ground Forces 1937–45" by Leland Ness, Bin Shih)
Seems about right, I got mine using assumptions from my source because it only mentioned the equipment of a section minus the SMG for the section leader which is 1 LMG and 10 rifles per section. From your source it seems, however, a squad should be a squad of 16, did the source mentioned the time of this organisation? The German-trained divisions, most well documented one being the 88th, were mostly wiped out after the first year or so with the 88th definitely wiped out in Nanking in 1937.

p.s. What would be really interesting is playing Chinese Warlords in a game set in 1920s, but the sources are very difficult to find even for a Chinese.

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Truscott Trotter
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Re: Proposal for Chinese Nationalist Army List

Post by Truscott Trotter »

The book is very detailed and covers Chinese armies from 1937 onwards but includes details leading up to the war.

It also divides the organizations into Nationalist, Communist and Warlord.

It then subdivides into the almost yearly changes in TO&E

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