Vehicle questions

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fabambina
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Vehicle questions

Post by fabambina »

This is a repeat, and I hope it doesn't upset anyone, but I want to reach a larger audience.

Sorry for all the questions, guys, but the brain has just started working top form again recently, and I've got to re-remember things!

1. When you deploy a Regular vehicle, it deploys up to 6" from the point you choose on the table's edge, road, etc. Does that mean 6" from the front or the rear of the vehicle?

2. When an ATG fires at an Armoured Carrier, do the hits or shock apply to the unit being transported?

3. When the hit result table in the above example indicates a certain amount of hits to the passengers, what kind of cover bonus do they get? Does the AP round hit them as HE?

4. When an Armoured Carrier has a mounted LMG, like a Hanomag, is it a tripod mounted MG or regular?

5. When a vehicle deploys, does it count as having moved, and therefore halve its shots from an MMG?

6. Does a vehicle mounted LMG, again like a Hanomag, have a 90 degree arc of fire?

Thanks!

Archdukek
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Re: Vehicle questions

Post by Archdukek »

I’ll be interested to see if you gather any different answers from those provided on the CoC FaceBook page. Meantime I will copy my answer from there to here for the record:

“On 1, I treat it the same as deploying an infantry squad from a JOP so no part of the hull may be more than 6” away from the deployment point be that road entry or table edge. I can see an argument for measuring to the centre of the vehicle, but not the rear.
2. The net result on table 13 will determine if any hits are on the passengers. Otherwise the hits and shock affect the vehicle and it’s crew.
3. Like Chris I’ve always treated the hits on passengers as being in the open on the basis that the armour must have been penetrated to cause them any damage.
4. In my opinion the LMG on an armoured carrier is not on a sustained fire tripod mount so doesn’t qualify as an MMG so I would treat it as a regular LMG of that type even though it’s mount is better than a bipod. Others will disagree.
5. As Chris said “deployment isn’t movement” so there is no penalty on firing.
6. The 90’ arc limitation is for a hull MG on a tank. I’d treat it as a coaxial MG in a turret and give it the 120’ arc. Seems too generous to give it the 180’ arc it would have if dismounted.“

John

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Truscott Trotter
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Re: Vehicle questions

Post by Truscott Trotter »

My 2c worth for the record

1. Agree with Archduke above

2. Agree with Archduke above - this has been discussed recently although the APC passengers form the crew for game purposes it is better to treat the two separately

3. Agree with Archduke above no cover as a penetrating hit the means the armour splinters are actually likely to cause more damage.

4. Here I disagree as the table 4 on p.37 is clear - under vehicle weapons it says Top Mounted MMG or HMG I actually don't think a difference of ROF 2 is worth rewriting the rules for so I play it at 10. IMHO it is about relative/effective ROF not theoretical, otherwise a MG-42 with ROF 1200 rpm would not have only 1/3 more FP in the game than a Bren with ROF 450 rpm

5. Agree with Archduke above

6. This is not specifically covered in the rules and I can see arguments for 120 and 90 degrees. in practice I see little difference as most of the time the APC will be moving into position. So as long as you both agree. FWIW where the real issue comes with the rear AAMG and its are of fire ;) :lol:

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Seret
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Re: Vehicle questions

Post by Seret »

fabambina wrote:
Sun Jun 14, 2020 5:56 am
1. When you deploy a Regular vehicle, it deploys up to 6" from the point you choose on the table's edge, road, etc. Does that mean 6" from the front or the rear of the vehicle?
The rules don't actually say, so as long as you do it the same way every time then I don't see a problem with either.
2. When an ATG fires at an Armoured Carrier, do the hits or shock apply to the unit being transported?
The shock is on the vehicle crew, but you might also get hits on passengers that result in them picking up shock of their own.
3. When the hit result table in the above example indicates a certain amount of hits to the passengers, what kind of cover bonus do they get? Does the AP round hit them as HE?
No cover, so it doesn't really matter if you count it as HE or not, just roll for troops in the open.
4. When an Armoured Carrier has a mounted LMG, like a Hanomag, is it a tripod mounted MG or regular?
As the archduke says, it's not tripod mounted or an MMG, so no it doesn't get 10 dice. Personally I just apply KISS and treat it like any other vehicle MG. So 6 dice. Some feel that shortchanges the ultimate uberness that is the MG42 so they leave it as 8d6. I think that's overcomplicating things as we don't differentiate between types of MGs (eg: MG34 or M1919) when in a hull or coax mount, so I don't differentiate for a top mount either.
5. When a vehicle deploys, does it count as having moved, and therefore halve its shots from an MMG?
Nope, deployment isn't movement.
6. Does a vehicle mounted LMG, again like a Hanomag, have a 90 degree arc of fire?
Again, nothing specific in the rules for this, but that sounds fine to me. In practice the fact that you can move the vehicle means things won't be out of arc, and Hanomags usually have better things to do than shoot anyway.

fabambina
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Re: Vehicle questions

Post by fabambina »

Thanks, guys!

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Truscott Trotter
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Re: Vehicle questions

Post by Truscott Trotter »

Actually there is an exception to No.5
When deploying a wheeled vehicle it can move and thus its ROF is reduced.

batesmotel34
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Re: Vehicle questions

Post by batesmotel34 »

I tend to treat the 6" deployment limit for vehicles to the center of the turret/vehicle. Otherwise given the size of 1/48 and 1/56 vehicles, The vehicle size itself is a significant fraction of 6".

Chris

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Iztvan
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Re: Vehicle questions

Post by Iztvan »

Seret wrote:
Mon Jun 15, 2020 8:54 am
fabambina wrote:
Sun Jun 14, 2020 5:56 am
4. When an Armoured Carrier has a mounted LMG, like a Hanomag, is it a tripod mounted MG or regular?
As the archduke says, it's not tripod mounted or an MMG, so no it doesn't get 10 dice. Personally I just apply KISS and treat it like any other vehicle MG. So 6 dice. Some feel that shortchanges the ultimate uberness that is the MG42 so they leave it as 8d6. I think that's overcomplicating things as we don't differentiate between types of MGs (eg: MG34 or M1919) when in a hull or coax mount, so I don't differentiate for a top mount either.
Just to add my 2c - I would leave the 10 dice for dedicated carriers like the British MMG carrier with a Vickers MG.
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Seret
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Re: Vehicle questions

Post by Seret »

Iztvan wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 6:23 am
Just to add my 2c - I would leave the 10 dice for dedicated carriers like the British MMG carrier with a Vickers MG.
Me too.

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