1:100 (15mm) scale or 1:56 (28mm) scale?

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dalemunk
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Re: 1:100 (15mm) scale or 1:56 (28mm) scale?

Post by dalemunk » Sat Jun 16, 2018 1:30 pm

Contrarius wrote:
Sat Jun 16, 2018 11:38 am
I'm a bit concerned by the question - why only mention 15mm or 28mm?

What happened to the scale that more or less started the whole wargaming thing back in the 1960s/70s, namely 1/72 (or 1/76)? Has it became obsolete? It's not as if there are no tanks available in this scale. In fact there's almost certainly a wider variety available than in 15mm or 28mm, especially in more obscure vehicles. And there's a huge variety of terrain, which ties in with the very popular OO scale for railway modellers.

Recently came across a set of new rules for Napoleonic wargaming and they also mention only 15mm and 28mm. We live in worrying times (if you're a 1/72 scale gamer).
No worries, we're playing lots in 20mm / 1/72. There's loads available as well, there's all the model makers at 1/72 (or 1/76 at a pinch), then there's the manufacturers that cater more specifically for wargamers, and are quite cheap with simplified models (PSC, Armourfast), and there's loads that do resin (and even metal: SHQ comes to mind) in 20mm (Early War Miniatures and many many more).

Contrarius
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Re: 1:100 (15mm) scale or 1:56 (28mm) scale?

Post by Contrarius » Sat Jun 16, 2018 2:01 pm

Ah, so it's a Flames of War/ Bolt Action thing. Should have guessed really. I'd never heard of either until a few months ago when I got back into gaming after a long sabbatical break. ;)

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Seret
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Re: 1:100 (15mm) scale or 1:56 (28mm) scale?

Post by Seret » Sat Jun 16, 2018 8:49 pm

Contrarius wrote:
Sat Jun 16, 2018 11:38 am
What happened to the scale that more or less started the whole wargaming thing back in the 1960s/70s, namely 1/72 (or 1/76)? Has it became obsolete?
Not obsolete, but it's definitely not as popular as it used to be.

The WSS Great Wargaming Survey is probably the closest thing we've got to hard data on people's preferences. Overall you find that:
  1. 28mm is most popular
  2. 15mm is about half as popular as 28mm
  3. Somewhat behind 15mm comes a group with 20mm, 10mm and 6mm all about equally popular
So 20mm/1:72/1:76 is still around, for sure. I think the reason it's dropped back in popularity is that 28mm looks much nicer for platoon-level and 15mm looks better for company/battalion, and anything bigger than that probably needs 6mm. So for a lot of games 20mm is kind of an in-between scale. Pretty good for WaT though, we've been playing some games with 20mm, because it's what one of the guys had already.

Contrarius
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Re: 1:100 (15mm) scale or 1:56 (28mm) scale?

Post by Contrarius » Sun Jun 17, 2018 5:54 am

Thanks @Seret, for that extremely interesting info. I must say I'm really surprised by the huge decline in "1/72" (for want of an umbrella term) as a wargaming scale.

28mm does indeed look beautiful, but it's also extremely space hungry and difficult to transport (especially terrain) so that kinda rules it out for me. Meanwhile 15mm I find just that bit too small to paint comfortably. (I've given up on my 1/300 WW2 project and will probably sell all my tanks, as I get no pleasure from them at all.)

I'm still quite fond of my 15mm ancient armies (based for DBM) but don't expect to add to them. (In truth I found the rules were just too unhistorical and unrealistic, and stopped playing with them; but perhaps something new will come along.)

1/72 or 1/76 has been my favourite scale since age 7. Mostly that's down to Airfix and Matchbox, who dominated the market for decades. If Napoleonics or WW2 was your thing, almost everyone did it in that scale, moving up to 25mm metals once they got a "proper job". They were vaguely compatible, until Hinchcliffe started producing their supposedly 25mm (but actually 28mm) monsters, and so a new scale was born (at least I think that's how it happened...).

Tanks aside, I notice that Western European companies are not producing nearly as many 1/72 figures as they once used to. Most Airfix figures are now so badly dated, or just plain inaccurate, that they've more or less removed themselves from the wargaming market. Their place was filled by the likes of HaT and Italeri; but even their most useful sets are getting hard to source these days. Seems the only place where 1/72 is really flourishing is Eastern Europe, with manufacturers like Strelets, Zvezda, First To Fight, Mars, and several others.

Oh well, time to end this nostalgic rambling. It'll be interesting to see if What A Tanker has any impact on this all...
Now, to work. Gotta buy a cheap airbrush to rejuvenate some of my old Airfix and Matchbox tanks.

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Truscott Trotter
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Re: 1:100 (15mm) scale or 1:56 (28mm) scale?

Post by Truscott Trotter » Sun Jun 17, 2018 8:46 am

Erm sold old off massive 1/72 collection in 1984 since then 15mm until 5 years ago swapped to 28mm. :ugeek:

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Re: 1:100 (15mm) scale or 1:56 (28mm) scale?

Post by Another_Gamer » Mon Jul 09, 2018 11:50 am

Yes, timing can be an important factor when we talk about model scales. For example, there was a time when lots of players would be using 1/72 to play WaT because of cost, and more importantly, large selection and availability.

Later with the introduction of more and more 15mm (1/100) miniatures (FoW), this could easily have been one of the predominate scales players would use to play WaT.

Sure, the availability of 1/35 and a limited availability of 1/48 has always been there, but only recently has good 1/56 scale models been made available to the gamer. Since the Lardies use 1/56 in their demo games (conventions and videos), this has been an influential as a scale choice.

Now that I have played multiple games of WaT, I can say for certain that I would prefer using 1/72 or 1/56 scale miniatures, but have no issues with using 1/100 scale miniatures. However, I can't see myself playing WaT with my 1/144* or 1/285** scale miniatures.

* Classic Armor, Pegasus, Bandi, World Tank Museum, and so on.
** GHQ Micro Armor, C-in-C Miniatures, and so on.

Short answer is simply this. Use whatever scale you feel most comfortable with based on what is available to you and your gaming group.

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Re: 1:100 (15mm) scale or 1:56 (28mm) scale?

Post by Wulf » Mon Jul 09, 2018 12:32 pm

Another_Gamer wrote:
Mon Jul 09, 2018 11:50 am
Now that I have played multiple games of WaT, I can say for certain that I would prefer using 1/72 or 1/56 scale miniatures, but have no issues with using 1/100 scale miniatures. However, I can't see myself playing WaT with my 1/144* or 1/285** scale miniatures.
I use 10/12mm scale (1:144, 1:150, 1:160, whatever...). I cannot see me attempting to play with anything smaller, certainly not as the rules are written - turning the turret on a 10mm scale Panzer II is fiddly enough for me! The scale does make the battlefield much bigger though - we use 2cm to the rulebook inch, and quite happily play on a 4'x4' table - actually about 4'x3', since the tank control panels sit at each side!

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Re: 1:100 (15mm) scale or 1:56 (28mm) scale?

Post by Another_Gamer » Mon Jul 09, 2018 4:01 pm

Does anyone play WaT using their old collection of Roco models?

I know, talk about a blast from the past.

The Roco miniatures are 1/87 scale, and at one time there was an extensive line of WW2 vehicles.

Image

Contrarius
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Re: 1:100 (15mm) scale or 1:56 (28mm) scale?

Post by Contrarius » Mon Jul 09, 2018 7:32 pm

Another_Gamer wrote:
Mon Jul 09, 2018 4:01 pm
Does anyone play WaT using their old collection of Roco models?

I know, talk about a blast from the past.

The Roco miniatures are 1/87 scale, and at one time there was an extensive line of WW2 vehicles.

Image
Saw some of these on auction at the weekend. Since it's the same as the railway modeller's HO scale I've always imagined it was a European (ie Continental) thing. There's lots of (railway) terrain available for this scale, and 1/100 and 15mm buildings will suit at a pinch. Can't see it ever catching on in the UK though, where most railway modellers went for OO scale - as in 1/76 (or 1/72). Just not the figures and vehicles available, unless you count those ridiculously overpriced Preiser figures...

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SteveBurt
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Re: 1:100 (15mm) scale or 1:56 (28mm) scale?

Post by SteveBurt » Mon Jul 16, 2018 10:56 am

I have quite a few minitanks vehicles. Back in the 70s they were often the only option available for some vehicles, we we just ignored the fact they were too small. If you look at Charles Grant's 'Battle' rules you'll see minitanks in many of the pictures.

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