Hell Driving!

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Amaz_Ed
Posts: 33
Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2014 10:57 pm

Re: Hell Driving!

Post by Amaz_Ed » Mon May 21, 2018 12:13 pm

Morgan,

You have just pointed out the exact problem that I have with your response. You say that the Russian SHOOTS, and then uses his AIM dice to add bonuses. The rule book says: Any number of AIM dice can be used when firing to reflect careful aiming immediately before the gun fires. My intention was to play the Hell Driving card "immediately before the gun fires".

Now I can see how this could be read either way as the sentence is somewhat ambiguous. Either way it would be lovely to have a final word from one of the main men.

Wulf
Posts: 268
Joined: Sat Sep 07, 2013 9:23 am

Re: Hell Driving!

Post by Wulf » Mon May 21, 2018 12:14 pm

I'd have thought you had to aim before you shoot - so if you are reacting to the shoot die not the aim dice the dice would have been applied before the dodge, and would therefore be lost. It does depend on which act the card reacts to...

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Greg Bradfield
Posts: 92
Joined: Fri Sep 06, 2013 6:09 am

Re: Hell Driving!

Post by Greg Bradfield » Mon May 21, 2018 1:05 pm

Agreed Wulf it depends on where you play the card after the aim or after the shoot, but that will bring me back can any person react that fast? It simply feels unrealistic and therefore in my opinion gamey playing it after the shoot.

Amaz_Ed
Posts: 33
Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2014 10:57 pm

Re: Hell Driving!

Post by Amaz_Ed » Mon May 21, 2018 1:08 pm

It wasn't played after the shot. It was played immediately the Russian player said that he was aiming with all three dice, before the shot was taken. So it comes down to the question, in my opinion, of whether the extra aim dice are treated as aim dice, or as wild dice that give +1's to the shot.

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Greg Bradfield
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Re: Hell Driving!

Post by Greg Bradfield » Mon May 21, 2018 1:14 pm

If that is the case I would still rule the 2 other aims are still available as the shot was not taken and therefore not used.

Wulf
Posts: 268
Joined: Sat Sep 07, 2013 9:23 am

Re: Hell Driving!

Post by Wulf » Mon May 21, 2018 1:24 pm

Greg Bradfield wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 1:14 pm
If that is the case I would still rule the 2 other aims are still available as the shot was not taken and therefore not used.
But the gunner had aimed - he'd spent the time and effort BEFORE the card was played/target moved. So that aim was wasted and the dice lost, if we're looking at this in terms of sequence of events. To aim once, lose it, and aim again with the same dice is as unrealistic as dodging a shot...

Peter
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Joined: Wed Sep 04, 2013 1:41 pm

Re: Hell Driving!

Post by Peter » Mon May 21, 2018 1:50 pm

To be honest I can live with either interpretation. As it's a one-off card, I rather like going with Wulf's interpretation - it makes things more dramatic, and maybe a reason not to take too long in taking aim.

Peter

bob696
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Joined: Mon Apr 25, 2016 4:09 pm

Re: Hell Driving!

Post by bob696 » Mon May 21, 2018 8:17 pm

Wulf wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 1:24 pm
Greg Bradfield wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 1:14 pm
If that is the case I would still rule the 2 other aims are still available as the shot was not taken and therefore not used.
But the gunner had aimed - he'd spent the time and effort BEFORE the card was played/target moved. So that aim was wasted and the dice lost, if we're looking at this in terms of sequence of events. To aim once, lose it, and aim again with the same dice is as unrealistic as dodging a shot...
I would agree IF the german had broken the line of sight (which is IMO the use of the card ...to dodge behind an obstacle). If a moving tank was to suddenly speed up the gunner would have to adjust his aim and so have a less carefully lined up shot but he would still have a shot. It would also be a crucial card if it was to disrupt a snap shot i.e. the russian had only 1 aim die (or non and was already aimed) and could have been played at any time.

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Quackstheking
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Location: Cheshunt, Herts

Re: Hell Driving!

Post by Quackstheking » Tue May 22, 2018 7:19 am

Equally you could argue that in trying to improve his aim, he took that little bit longer allowing the opponent to skedaddle out of there!

According to the rules the extra aim dice are allocated in the aim phase NOT the shooting phase. On this basis I would say they are lost as the hell driver tank plays his card between the aim phase (after the dice have been committed) but before shooting!

Key lesson - keep an aim dice in the bank!

Don

bob696
Posts: 62
Joined: Mon Apr 25, 2016 4:09 pm

Re: Hell Driving!

Post by bob696 » Tue May 22, 2018 10:36 am

Quackstheking wrote:
Tue May 22, 2018 7:19 am
Equally you could argue that in trying to improve his aim, he took that little bit longer allowing the opponent to skedaddle out of there!

again i would agree if he had broken line of sight

BTW I can find no mention of an 'aim phase'

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