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Re: PTO Here we go!

Posted: Fri Feb 20, 2015 12:50 pm
by Emilio
I am reading now one of Gordon Rotmn´s books. It says that strenghtened units added one grenade discharger to the section. May be that this is the reason sometimes you get three or four dischargers. Type A units seems to be bigger than B type units, that are the standard.

Re: PTO Here we go!

Posted: Fri Feb 20, 2015 12:58 pm
by rim66
Rich,

The Liaison NCOs role was to relay the Plt Comd's orders, so a runner with clout (probably literally!).

Richard/Monty Lardo

Re: PTO Here we go!

Posted: Fri Feb 20, 2015 1:16 pm
by olyreed
This is fascinating reading, and a great divergence from work related things, I cant really input anything but looking forward to the end results so I can finish up my Japanese.

Re: PTO Here we go!

Posted: Fri Feb 20, 2015 2:10 pm
by Richard
Hi Emilio.

LMG squad is just terminology. It means that the squad has an LMG in it, i.e. It isn't just riflemen. This is the terminology of the 1944 handbook. The japs then broke this down into four sections. This is really exciting stuff.

Rich

Re: PTO Here we go!

Posted: Fri Feb 20, 2015 2:12 pm
by Richard
Monty. That's my reading of it too.

Rich

Re: PTO Here we go!

Posted: Fri Feb 20, 2015 2:56 pm
by Nick B
My understanding is the same as Rich's that Type A was used in China and Type B in Burma (and Malaya).

I would also concurr that the Platoon Sergeant was not a "Senior Leader" in CoC terms.

I have seen no other sources in any contemporary field book or manual suggesting the Japanese section was broken down into 4 teams (3 rifle/1 LMG) so personally I would perfer some more detail on the source or corroboration before adopting significant changes to the section structure.

I guess in game terms however it will make little difference as a JL will still only be able to activate 2 teams or the entire section. It will affect Japanese resilience as they could quickly lose teams (especially against the British who can concentrate Bren fire on one team).

Nick

Re: PTO Here we go!

Posted: Fri Feb 20, 2015 3:08 pm
by Emilio
Richard wrote:Hi Emilio.

LMG squad is just terminology. It means that the squad has an LMG in it, i.e. It isn't just riflemen. This is the terminology of the 1944 handbook. The japs then broke this down into four sections. This is really exciting stuff.

Rich

Sorry Rich, I meant that the LMG team for the game would be of a LMG with three crew plus a rifleman.

Re: PTO Here we go!

Posted: Fri Feb 20, 2015 3:13 pm
by Emilio
I may be wrong, but it seems to my that A type units are reinforced ones, and B type are the satndard ones. For instance, A divisions were mainly used in Manchuria, and B type in the Pacific, although a couple of A type divisions were used in the Pacific too. What I don´t know is if A type companies belong to A type divisions and B type companies to B type divisions.

Re: PTO Here we go!

Posted: Fri Feb 20, 2015 3:31 pm
by Richard
Emilio

I've just been trying to get any supporting evidence for this from Japanese sources. It seems that the LMG had three crew and any surplus were there to carry ammo, but had rifles.

Also the "runner with clout" theory is supported, so Junior Leader for the Platoon NCO. Interestingly each squad would have a liaison soldier, so that looks like the communication line was two way.

What I have yet to confirm is the infantry section thing. However, bearing in mind what Nick is saying, I find this idea very likely. Everywhere I have been today, I have found the same old stuff churned out, all of which comes form the technical manual I have in front of me. It is treated as absolute gospel. This is as true of Rottmann as everyone else. I have seen this before where one source gets quoted so many times (often without being credited) that an error becomes an article of faith. I mentioned earlier how worried I was about one source for the Japs, and a foreign one at that.

So, I shall continue my search. What book was that you took the scans from Emilio? It looks like a Japanese Osprey.

Rich

Re: PTO Here we go!

Posted: Fri Feb 20, 2015 3:45 pm
by Emilio
http://www.pacificwrecks.com/reviews/ja ... -arms.html

I agree with you that most people copy again and again the same things...