Rules for buttoned/unbuttoned AFVs?

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hedgehobbit
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Re: Rules for buttoned/unbuttoned AFVs?

Post by hedgehobbit »

topi wrote:In many pictures the person manning aamg is outside the tank completely. How easy is it to man the aamg in, say, sherman, while remaining inside the tank? Or is it doable at all?
Originally, Shermans came out of the factory with the AA MG mounted on the rear of the turret. So you could use it without getting out of the tank but only to shoot things that were behind you. I think other US vehicles like the M8 Greyhound were originally setup this way. The later M4A3 tanks had a .30 cal mounted on the front of the turret as seen in Fury. There were field mods as well. The Greyhounds added a ring mount so you could fire in all direction but that vehicle was open topped so the firer isn't technically outside the vehicle.

So the answer is that it depends.

Shirty
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Re: Rules for buttoned/unbuttoned AFVs?

Post by Shirty »

"Germans in all theatres fought head out......and lost a lot of heads
Soviets almost always fought buttoned up ....and lost a lot of tanks
Western allies?"

Hahaha!

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Truscott Trotter
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Re: Rules for buttoned/unbuttoned AFVs?

Post by Truscott Trotter »

I am hoping that the new vehicle compendium will fix those issues and I agree on rereading that there is no capacity to throw a grenade down a hatch

sackatatties
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Re: Rules for buttoned/unbuttoned AFVs?

Post by sackatatties »

This came up yesterday in one of our games and there probably isn't the capacity in the rules to drop a grenade down an open tank hatch. That of course is up to the players as the rules are not intended to be proscriptive (as far as I can gather).

There are historical precedents with the like of Japanese infantry dropping grenades and charges down open Stuart tank hatches using poles. They were successful on at least two occasions at Mandalay according to first hand accounts. It was from the cover of secondary jungle though!

As far as open turrets/bodies are concerned - why not just look at the model??? Who needs a chart when it's under yer beak....

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Truscott Trotter
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Re: Rules for buttoned/unbuttoned AFVs?

Post by Truscott Trotter »

Ummm because some are listed incorrectly in the book so pointing to your model and it being the opposite of the book may cause unnecessary waste of discussion time.
Why not simply get the stats correct it isn't that hard?

For example is a PzIV flak (Ost or Wible) open body or open turret?
There are 2 entries for Pz38T flak with different stats I expext one of them os for a different vehicle but it is not erratad - presumably because those entries are to be replaced by a complete arsenal - shortly

Anyway back to the OP of buttoned and unbuttoned. I still say that you need a marker and a rule or two to cover loss if viability and 'maybe' being more vulnerable to a explosives being used by a tank hunter team or figure.
The question is, is it worth the extra complexity in the rules?

sackatatties
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Re: Rules for buttoned/unbuttoned AFVs?

Post by sackatatties »

Maybe count a buttoned up tank as a leaderless vehicle only activating on a one? Either that or reduce the available Command Initiatives by 1.
Unbuttoned vehicles are vulnerable to sniper fire (commander/driver) as if they were open topped but count full CI?

Looking forward to the new material for CoC.

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Seret
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Re: Rules for buttoned/unbuttoned AFVs?

Post by Seret »

Truscott Trotter wrote: The question is, is it worth the extra complexity in the rules?
Only one way to find out: play a few games with a house rule and see how it goes down. It's really going to depend on whether you play with wargamers who lean towards simulation or streamlining.

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Truscott Trotter
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Re: Rules for buttoned/unbuttoned AFVs?

Post by Truscott Trotter »

Personally I like to KISS so only being vulnerable to snipers while using AAMG and not having a grenade lobbed between the Turret ring and the commanders head is fine with me :)

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