French Groupe Frac Motorise' de Cavalerie

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Larson45
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French Groupe Frac Motorise' de Cavalerie

Post by Larson45 »

I have a question in reference to a French French Groupe Frac Motorise' de Cavalerie page 67 of the Blitzkrieg 1940 book and the Reconnaissance Motorcycle Fusiller Platoon, Page 56. If you mount a squad how many are needed to represent the squad?

Thank you
Levi the Ox
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Re: French Groupe Frac Motorise' de Cavalerie

Post by Levi the Ox »

Realistically, whatever you and your opponent agree on.

Mounted troops are interesting to use, but in Chain of Command they're unlikely to remain mounted for very long after they deploy. You could definitely get by with just a token or a single motorcycle alongside the foot figures to indicate it for the phase or two before they dismount.

If you want to depict the full squad mounted, there should be figure options, although it will be *significantly* cheaper in 15mm. I don't know if the French had pillion riders or not? My (15mm) German motorcycle squad is 3-4 motorcycle combinations with 3 figures apiece, depending on the unit and the point in the war.
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Truscott Trotter
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Re: French Groupe Frac Motorise' de Cavalerie

Post by Truscott Trotter »

Take number of men in squad divide by 3.
Left overs on combo with less than 3 or use single bike for leader.
Larson45
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Re: French Groupe Frac Motorise' de Cavalerie

Post by Larson45 »

We have been gaming in 15mm and 28mm I have a British Airborne force and German SS so far, you are correct cheeper in 15's than 28mm. Thank you for the clarification, that is what I was thinking. There is a local war gaming event on the from 11 November thru the 14th going to introduce Chain of Command and if time permits Sharp Practice. Thank you again for the help.
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7dot62mm
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Re: French Groupe Frac Motorise' de Cavalerie

Post by 7dot62mm »

The French seem to have had lots of different units with motorcycles and it is not always clear to me which 1940 Handbook unit corresponds to which real-life unit. There is also an important distiction between infantry and cavalry, which is sometimes unclear to me in the 1940 supplement.

Anyways, the "Instruction provisionaire pour les sections d'eclaireurs motorcyclistes d'infanterie" of 1938 gives this TOE for a motorcycle recce "section" (half-platoon, 1 groupe 2 escouades) of an INFANTRY REGIMENT:

1 chef de section (section leader)
1 observateur (observer)
1 moto avec side-car

1 sergent-chef adjoint (second-in-command)
1 dépanneur (mechanic)
1 moto avec side-car OR 2 motos solos

2 messengers
1 moto avec side-car OR 2 motos solos

Groupe:
1 sergent (groupe leader)
1 messenger
1 moto avec side-car OR 2 motos solos

1st "escouade"
1 caporal (escouade leader)
3 voltigeurs (soldiers)
2 moto avec side-car OR 4 motos solos

2nd "escouade"
(as 1st escouade)

... so if this is the "Reconnaissance Motorcycle Fusilier Platoon" on page 56 of the Blitzkrieg supplement (which I'm not convinced it is as these guys are voltigeurs) then they do not seem to have any Tromblon VB grenade launchers. It is also possible that this temporary instruction was replaced with something else later which would then have VB launchers etc.

Notable in the above is that the French do not seem to ride three guys per motorcycle side-car, as many CoC-players seem to assume. This makes perfect sense as (especially French) motorcycles may break down so it is a good idea to have extra capacity. Each side-car mounts just two men so you'd need either 13 side-cars OR 1 side-car and 25 solo motorcycles.
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7dot62mm
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Re: French Groupe Frac Motorise' de Cavalerie

Post by 7dot62mm »

Then, the "Instruction provisoire pour les unités motocyclistes des formations de cavalerie" of 1936 gives this TOE for a CAVALRY groupe de combat:

1 NCO
1 Grenadier VB
1 moto avec side-car

1st "escouade"
1 brigadier (escouade leader)
1 purvoyer-conducteur (ammunition bearer/driver)
1 tireur (LMG gunner)
1 loader
2 moto avec side-car

2nd "escouade"
(as 1st escouade)

There is again a note that, due to insufficient supply, some or all of the motorcycles with side cars may be replaced with just two solo motorcycles.

Again you'll note that only two are riding per motorcycle side-car.
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Truscott Trotter
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Re: French Groupe Frac Motorise' de Cavalerie

Post by Truscott Trotter »

Ok divide by 2
And get a bank loan :lol:
Larson45
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Re: French Groupe Frac Motorise' de Cavalerie

Post by Larson45 »

that would be too many in 28mm may work out good in 15's thank you for the information
poiter50
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Re: French Groupe Frac Motorise' de Cavalerie

Post by poiter50 »

I'm currently reading (and translating) Histoire et Collections "Chasseurs D'Afrique" which at one stage gives (IIRC) 13 MC avec side car for a platoon. A pic shows them travelling down a road, appears to be a platoon group. Perhaps they are smaller platoons but it seems each Regiment had at least 1 or 2 of these MC mounted platoons. I will see what else the book reveals in my dubious translation. Interesting to see the diversity of Armoured Car, APC and Tanks, Even the Char D1 gets a mention although some of them appear to have vanished when it came to an Audit/reckoning in mid WW2 after the Italians ordered them to hand them over.
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Emilio
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Re: French Groupe Frac Motorise' de Cavalerie

Post by Emilio »

I think that the info you need is here:

http://www.atf40.fr/ATF40/divers/GRDI%20normal%202.pdf
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