Selecting British Airborne Section with 2 LMGs from Support list?

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JOHN BOND 001
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Selecting British Airborne Section with 2 LMGs from Support list?

Post by JOHN BOND 001 »

My question:
Normally Platoons will select Support units from their support list so a Player fielding a Regular British infantry Platoon is free to select another Regular Infantry section from Support list 4.
Again player fielding a British Airborne platoon could select a Regular Airborne section as support from list 6.
My question relates to what type of section can the British Airborne select as its normally made up of 2 sections with one Bren and 1 section with 2 Brens.
I know that in campaign games troops organisation can be reorganized due to losses so it maybe feasible for 2 rifle depleted section to combine them to make up a full section which would have 2 Brens present .

Personally I think it is a bit " gamey" for a British Para platoon to select the section with the 2 brens as I think the intentions of the support as listed is for a section that would more commonly available, that being the one with only 1 Bren.

Ps I like the Paras and not being bias , I have a collection on the Lead pile waiting to be painted one day :)

cheers John

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Truscott Trotter
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Re: Selecting British Airborne Section with 2 LMGs from Support list?

Post by Truscott Trotter »

I guess in theory it should be one support level higher, would need to check coculator.

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Seret
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Re: Selecting British Airborne Section with 2 LMGs from Support list?

Post by Seret »

Para sections only ever had one Been gun allocated to them. The platoon had a fourth gun, which the platoon commander could use at their discretion, but Rich had decided in his list to have it permanently with the third section. I think that's an unusual decision, because platoons of other nations also had spare guns and we don't get those by default in their lists. German infantry platoons had four or even five LMGs, for example.

So yes, I would definitely go for one Bren in your rent-a-squad. I would also prefer to see only one Bren in the three core sections, with an option of a fourth in the support list.

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Truscott Trotter
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Re: Selecting British Airborne Section with 2 LMGs from Support list?

Post by Truscott Trotter »

Or a 4th in the plt HQ?
Along with the second sniper 😉

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Seret
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Re: Selecting British Airborne Section with 2 LMGs from Support list?

Post by Seret »

And the third sniper, and the other two 2" mortars?

Para sections were all equipped identically and had one Bren, a 2" mortar, a No.4T scoped rifle, three Stens and five No.4s. Platoon HQ was just a couple of bodies with no PIAT.

Obviously that's quite unusual compared to a rifle platoon and you have to make some tweaks to get it to work sensibly in CoC. But the list in the rulebook is just one possible interpretation of how it could be done and not an actual gospel.

Personally I'd go for three identical sections and an HQ consisting just of the 2 SLs, with the option to include a 2" group in any section (or attached to the HQ) and an option to field up to three snipers. Put the PIAT and the fourth Bren on the support lists.
Last edited by Seret on Sun Sep 15, 2019 11:12 am, edited 2 times in total.

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JOHN BOND 001
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Re: Selecting British Airborne Section with 2 LMGs from Support list?

Post by JOHN BOND 001 »

Thanks TT and Andy

What about the US Armoured rifle platoon it’s made up of:
• HQ squad with a 7 man rifle team ,
• 2 x Rifle squads with 11 men
• 60mm 5 man Mortar squad
• 1 x Machine gun squad with a Junior Leader and 2 x MG team each with M1917 and 5 crew.

Fielding such a Platoon one can choose an extra Regular Infantry squad in Support list 4.
My question is, can a player choose the Machine gun squad as a Infantry squad or should he stick to a squad as per Rifle squad?

Personally I think it is a bit " gamey" to select the MG squad .

your thoughts
cheers John

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Truscott Trotter
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Re: Selecting British Airborne Section with 2 LMGs from Support list?

Post by Truscott Trotter »

I don't think it would be gamey if it was priced accordingly.

US companies often had spare MG's to be allocated, especially AI and Paras.

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Re: Selecting British Airborne Section with 2 LMGs from Support list?

Post by Archdukek »

I think that particular support option in all lists is clearly intended to be a standard rifle squad for the platoon concerned and not one of the specialist squads you find in some platoons.

If you wanted to allow the selection of the specialist squads as support then I'd suggest you need to price them up using the CoCulator.

John

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Re: Selecting British Airborne Section with 2 LMGs from Support list?

Post by batesmotel34 »

So how about for 1943 Soviets for the Kursk campaigns. Their platoons have 2 sections with 1 LMG and 2 sections with 2 LMG. Obviously the 2 LMG sections would seem the better option in general. (They're all 8 men plus JL sections.) I'd certainly go for one of each if buying 2 sections.

Chris

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Steve McG
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Re: Selecting British Airborne Section with 2 LMGs from Support list?

Post by Steve McG »

Archdukek wrote:
Sun Sep 15, 2019 4:52 pm
I think that particular support option in all lists is clearly intended to be a standard rifle squad for the platoon concerned and not one of the specialist squads you find in some platoons.

If you wanted to allow the selection of the specialist squads as support then I'd suggest you need to price them up using the CoCulator.

John
I think the particular point here is that the "Regular Infantry Squad" on List 4 of the US support list is probably a Squad for an Infantry Battalion. this would be wrong for the Armoured Infantry. They have a number of "Infantry" Squads in their Platoon. These are detailed in the "Table of Organisation 7-27 Rifle Company, Armoured Infantry Regiment" and reflected in the US LIst on P93.

The MG Squad is NOT a specialist Squad but squad which EVERY Armd Inf Pl has. (so 3xper Company + 3xCompanies per Battalion + 3x Battalion per Regiment). That is a lot of MG Squads which can be used as support. This is the same number of 60mm Squads which are on the list and allowed. This is way more than the "Engineers" which are on the list. Engineers are not at Company/Battalion or Regimental level. Those are specialists indeed.

To be accurate to the structure of the US Armoured Infantry we should probably add the following:

Rifle Squad with JL + 10 x Riflemen with M1 + 1 x SMG (no option for Bazooka) @ 20 points so List 4
MG Squad with JL + 2 x Tripod MGs (Belt Fed) with 5 Crew each @ 22 points so List 4

This will allow the US Armd Rifle Platoon to be supported by troops from the Company or within the Battalion. This seems not only reasonable but balanced.

John Bond asks a good question about whether it is "Gamey" to allow a MG Squad. Probably not. There were lots of them. They are not "Over Powered". They have less firepower than Panzer Grenadiers and they are weaker in the attack than these as well.

So costed properly that should be fine.

Steve
There's a fundamental truth to our nature. Man must explore. ... Neil Armstrong

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