Questions

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Questions

Post by MLB »

A few questions came up in a game today.

Can you interrupt a unit as it deploys and fires? We were both sure you couldn’t but could not find anything in the rule book or the FAQ. Were we imagining it?

The Gembloux PSC notes on pg 14 say:

“For both players, casualties are treated according to the rules in At the Sharp End, with losses in each game being split into those never to return, those who are lightly wounded and return for the next game and those who miss the next game.
At the start of the campaign your CO’s opinion is 0 and men’s opinion is +1.”

However on the next page under the campaign briefing notes for the French is says:

“At the start of the campaign your CO’s opinion and men’s opinion are both 0.”

The German campaign notes say nothing about either opinion. Confused? We were. Which is it? We’ve settled on the first.

Red dice - The requirement to have at least three support units before allowing a side to choose a red dice means it’s very unlikely that it will be possible to actually add a red dice in many scenarios. For example the first Gembloux scenario gives the Germans 10 points, so if we deduct 2 for the red dice this leaves 8 points for three supports units. It’s not clear if things like Stukas count as inanimate supports as they are not under command on the table (which raises similar questions about things like a pre-game barrage), even if they are, if the Germans choose the Stukas and say the 75 infantry gun that’s 8 points and therefore the red dice would not be permitted. Why not?

I may be wrong but I seem to recall that in the Lard TV playing of this scenario Rich had a red dice but his supports were the MMG team and the 75 infantry gun (which left only one point and I can’t recall what that was for). Now I know Rich is notorious for getting his own rules wrong, but it does strike me that the three support requirements plus the 2 points for the red dice will often mean the red dice isn’t an option. I just wonder how necessary the three unit requirement needs to be? It wouldn’t seem unreasonable to allow the red dice if the remaining points were spent on actual units, even if it’s only one from high up on the list?
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Captain W Martin
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Re: Questions

Post by Captain W Martin »

Ive put this on the FB page and tagged Andy and Rich

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john de terre neuve
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Re: Questions

Post by john de terre neuve »

Some high quality units have a support option of a “red dice” which allows them to have an additional Command Dice if they select three or more support units (inanimate objects such as wire, entrenchments do not count towards this total).
I am not sure if Stukas, OT MMG etc count as inanimate object from reading this.

Again I maybe wrong but I believe you can use an interupt anytime except to interupt an interupt.

John

ps.................waiting to be proven wrong

JimLeCat
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Re: Questions

Post by JimLeCat »

To be precise, you can only interrupt during your opponent's phase, one consequence of which is that you can't interrupt an interrupt.

As to interrupting an opponent who is intending to deploy and fire, you can interrupt before or after they deploy, but you can't shoot at them since you don't have a target until they have fired, if that's what you're asking. All you can do is move into a better position, the best case being to shut down the JOP before they deploy.

Hope that helps,

Cheers,
Jim

batesmotel34
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Re: Questions

Post by batesmotel34 »

I would allow use of an interrupt before a deploy to move to shutdown a JOP. For a player deploying and firing, I would allow an interrupt to be used before the fire of the deployed unit is conducted. In this respect interrupting is more powerful than overwatch where the overwatching unit only fires after the deployed unit has fired. I wouldn't allow an interrupt to be used against an ambushing unit on the turn of the player doing the ambush. That probably isn't specified in the rules but seems contrary to the idea of an ambush versus a normal unit deployment.

Chris

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Re: Questions

Post by Archdukek »

Like Jim I wouldn't allow an Interrupt to fire on a deploying unit before it fires for the same reason, the enemy unit is hidden and its position is only revealed when it fires. Until then you don't know it's there.
Nor can you use Interrupt on Ambushers until after they fire, see Ambush section on page 23.

John

AndyC
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Re: Questions

Post by AndyC »

MLB wrote:
Thu Aug 08, 2019 10:06 am

The Gembloux PSC notes on pg 14 say:

“For both players, casualties are treated according to the rules in At the Sharp End, with losses in each game being split into those never to return, those who are lightly wounded and return for the next game and those who miss the next game.
At the start of the campaign your CO’s opinion is 0 and men’s opinion is +1.”

However on the next page under the campaign briefing notes for the French is says:

“At the start of the campaign your CO’s opinion and men’s opinion are both 0.”

The German campaign notes say nothing about either opinion. Confused? We were. Which is it? We’ve settled on the first.
Hi there. Yes, this is a slight mistake in the layout of the text. The last paragraph of page 14 should be appended to the end of the german player briefing on page 15.

To be clear, the Germans start the campaign with CO's opinion at 0 and men's opinion at +1. The French start the campaign with both CO and men's opinion at 0.

Cheers, Andy

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Re: Questions

Post by Truscott Trotter »

I was initially in the thry are hidden camp but looking at it logically I agree with Chris.

If you deploy and for whatever reason don't fire then I can see you and fire at you , yes?

So there must be a point at which I can interrupt were I can see you after deployment but before you fire?

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Re: Questions

Post by Archdukek »

Truscott Trotter wrote:
Thu Aug 08, 2019 7:08 pm
I was initially in the thry are hidden camp but looking at it logically I agree with Chris.

If you deploy and for whatever reason don't fire then I can see you and fire at you , yes?

So there must be a point at which I can interrupt were I can see you after deployment but before you fire?
I don't agree. In the first instance you effectively have the rest of the phase to identify that the deployed unit which is now visible is worth spending a CoC dice on to Interrupt and fire at it. In the second case your men literally would have seconds to react. If you can't react to ambushers popping up until after they've fired, then I don't see why you can shoot at troops whose presence is only revealed by their firing. Afterwards is fine.

John

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Re: Questions

Post by MLB »

I think there’s a danger of confusing terms and rules.

An interrupt is not the same as Overwatch in any way. They are two separate rules mechanics requiring completely different forms of activation. The fact an interrupt requires a CoC dice elevates it to a very different level.

Similarly deploying and firing is not the same as an ambush (although it can often feel that way). Once again they require different activations and the CoC die needed to ambush once again elevates it to a different level.

So interrupting deployment is not like interrupting an ambush, that’s to confuse two different rules mechanics. Similarly interrupting is not to be confused with Overwatch fire, that’s to interpret one rule mechanic by using another one for a completely different rule.

In a narrative sense the unit doing the interrupting has simply reacted quickly to the presence of the enemy or detected them before they fire. In effect they use the CoC die to ambush the deploying unit. It’s simply using the CoC die for a reverse ambush. This seems plausible, not every deployment goes off perfectly, someone makes too much noise or fails to conceal themselves properly and there’s a fleeting moment (use of the CoC die) where the opposing unit reacts rapidly and fires first.
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